Summer is Ending: News is Coming. EXCLUSIVE
Submitted by advisor on Wed, 08/25/2010 - 7:15am.
September is coming, vacations are over, and the kids will soon be back in school. This is the time when we each rediscover our cubicles, desks, files and piles of unfinished business sitting on the far right corner next to the phone. The first week of September brings a wave of productivity, decisions, purchases, product launches, closures, hirings, press releases, and we hope, appliance news which will sweep the nation.
Do you have news? Send it in.
Advisor
Has someone on the Advisor staff left their plush summer home on Martha's Vineyard yet ? Did they host Obama ?
Dacor
I am certain Dacor is going through those same hard times as most people. When you have to downsize it becomes more difficult.They will survive although at a much smaller size pretty much like everyone else. People have left and I am somewhat informed that they left because of better opportunities like most of us may jump at. Like I did to leave Dacor 10 years ago. In the end it works out for everyone. I wish MJ the very best.I wouldn't read negativity or doom into these changes.At 50,000 feet though the economy doesn't look like it will soon sprout wings.
next question, please!
Any news about Dacor of late? Hearing those same, nasty rumours again.
2 KEY EXECS/VPS HAVE LEFT
2 KEY EXECS/VPS HAVE LEFT DACOR IN LESS THAN ONE WEEK. THEY ARE NOT BEING REPLACED. DOES THAT ANSWER YOUR QUESTION? InsideOut
Names
I have been told the VP of Engr. George Simadaris and a Manufacturing guy named Andy who ran manufacturing have left over the past month . Don't know either one. Don't know the impact they had and from what I have heard about them it would not be fair to them to send those comments along. Although MJ does not have dumb people working for him. Again I think that they both received better offers. Kind of an open market deal.
Impact
Who is this MJ?These guys were the best they had according to one insider I spoke to.The engineer redesigned every last problem product they had.I am told the operations guy is the only reason the company existstoday. InsideOut
WiseGuy
MJ is the janitor and in fact these two guys may in fact have been good ,I have no idea but to MJ the newest guy is always the smartest. How are you doing Steve ? I wish you and daddy well.
The Italian Stallion
You remind me more of a hardhead or street thug from the streets of Philly or Fresno you choose the coast. Difference is you hide behind a veil of electronics. Answer the guys question honestly he wanted facts on Dacor. If you don't know, stop posting Stallion. All this historical nonsense about MJ and Steve who cares? Just because you supposedly worked at Dacor and DCS doesn't mean a thing that's the past.Lesson for you. You are a part of history and your insiders are not relevant. State facts only. Your love affair for the past makes me sick. As I said 2 execs have left. This is either the beginning of the end or just a new beginning. If you have facts state them stay silent otherwise.P.S. - Don't fret. Old dogs can learn new tricks. InsideOut
Speaking of the Italian Stallion. Where is John ?
One of my finest friends in the business John Novella who is part owner of BKE Supply a great distributor in Indio California is the true one and only Italian Stallion. The absolutely hardest worker I have ever been around. 20 hour days exhibiting grills , on the road constantly all the while never having a bad word to say about anyone. They don't carry top name brands such as Whirlpool , GE or Viking but they would represent those brands well.To my good friend who helped keep my business going for several more years. Here's to you John. He is what they call good people. Ciao
Enough is Enough
And further, stop your whiny attitude. My "love " affair as you put it has more to do with me wanting to show class more than it is about that organization itself. My love affair there was with the real people on the floor who did the work. That gets lost in the ego thing doesn't it ?
You Don't Care, Remember?
Don't even pretend to understand or care about the plight of these folks. These are the folks that cut your hair, mow your lawn, wash your car, and clean your soiled underware. They serve you well, that's the root of your love affair.If you cared, you would get off your crapper and post facts. I have read your posts for years. All self-serving historical rhetoric. There is a serious set of problems here. Please be compassionate for those that are suffering. Please. InsideOut
Wise Guy 2
Not a street thug. Not hiding. You know who I am . Some valid points. Maybe those guys are the best you have ever had. Would not surprise me. I am only commenting on what others who go out of their way to call me tell me. I also understand that leaders are always going to have some critics and I accept that as part of the process. Maybe these guys just got tired of all the noise in the organization , quite similar to your noise here. Maybe the market offered them a better opportunity. I am content with my decisions and hope they are too. So the info that I had said they were concerned for the future of the organization , worried about their positions and let the market dictate their worth. I commend them for the job they have done. I don't know either one of them but I have an idea of what they went through. So you had some bad products to fix over the past 10 years ? Great. I don't care either way. I have moved on and you need to do the same. You do have issues though wow. Read this again . I DON'T CARE ! Just passing along what I heard on the crapper. Have a wonderful day.
I Don't Care - Thanks Stallion, You are a True Gentlemen
The high-end appliance industry is dead. A lot of innocent people are hurt and will loose more jobs. Small companies are in shambles. Many are not going to make it. Top leadership are running for the hills. Stallion there is nothing you and I can do to change it. Am I upset. You are right I am. Do I have an issue? YES! Lambs are headed for slaughter. Lifestyles are changing for people in these companies. Maybe you don't care either way, but our families do. You may be able to move on but many of us cant.I have heard that Sub has not made a profit all year. I have heard that both Dacor and Sub are on the block at fire sale prices and no one wants either.It is the Obama's administration fault that has yet to solve these problems. Thanks for being a high-end advocate, You are a true gentlemen. InsideOut
Final Comments on Dacor to InsideOut
After many comments on Dacor it is only fair that after 10 years or so I put this to rest. The nine years I spent at Dacor were the best years anyone could imagine. I met many good people and we all did many good things together.The people working there were a wonderful group that would do anything for each other. No politics , resume building or in fighting. The two owners were and are the best two people I had ever worked for and were and are honest and caring. I wish them the best and would hope that the folks they get to run the organization are the best they can get. I can guess it is a tough time but if anyone can weather the storm it is MJ. I have now finally turned the corner from a really good experience. I wish them nothing but the very best. Please take care and as Mike says "Stay well and God bless" .
Death of a (Appliance) Segment
The high-end industry is not dead, but it is in a painful combination of recessionary slowdown + down-sizing + off-shoring + industry consolidation + focused entry of mass market brands + shakeout. It's going through the wringer, and very very few of those going in are going to be coming out the other side.
A great part of the industry's problems are self-inflicted.
-The industries failed to launch Tier 2 brands and invest in their success
-They failed to develop European sales. Failure to develop export products or export markets.
-They treated quality, reliability and service as an after thought
-They never got beyond commercial style to creative a new aesthetic style.
The biggest problem may have been that this industry, (this country) had grown for 3 decades with customers who borrowed against the artificial value of their real estate holdings, but did not actually have any real cash to speak of. The entire industry was built on the backs of clients who could not in the end support a 600 lb range.
Don't Forget ...
... there is significant concern about Obama wanting to eliminate the Bush Tax Cuts, which would have a significant cause-and-effect relationship, I believe ...
The elimination would be a "de facto" tax increase and cause an immediate depletion of disposable/discretionary income ... It is already known that there are no loans being made by all those banks we bailed out, so only those that "have" and are so disposed to build or remodel are making purchases ... and it may very well be that it is not "PC" to be installing the least austere of appliances when the "2nd Tier" will do very well, (thank you very much) !!!
The additional aspect of the influence of "green" adds to the misnomer that "ProStyle" is not particularly energy efficient, primarily because those manufacturers are not getting that type of message out there, if they are getting their message out at all !!!
"ProStyle" is certainly not dead, but someone ought to blow the dust off of those boxes from time to time ... and take the opportunity to train Sales Personnel how to more effectively "move" their products once they do get some interested folks thru the door !!!
Revisionism
-How can you be both against deficits and for tax cuts? Tax cuts equals more deficits.
-If the original bill included an expiration, and in the end the bill expires, the fault, or thanks goes to the original author. Therefore, the defacto tax increase you reference was authored by President Bush and his congress.
-Pro-style appliances are not energy efficient, though I'm not sure what your point here is referring to. At least in gas cooking, they have been far less efficient than traditional gas appliances, and we have the numbers to prove it.
-The reduction of the Prostyle segment is not correctable with a better saleforce, though an individual brand might benefit with sales tweaks. The world's a different place, and it isn't going back.
Presumptions & Demonism
I am of the opinion that ...
1. Revoking, or allowing the tax cuts to expire are a de facto tax increase at a time when Americans need every dollar they earn in their pockets ... that's for princes and paupers ...
2. The Deficit, while a philosophically abhorrent thing, can only be affected by ceasing spending, which would allow debt service to begin within the confines of what the Federal Government takes from us via taxes ...
When you consider #1 and #2 in the same bit of logistics, there is no way to allow the Tax Cuts to cease and try and reduce the Deficit @ the same time ...
3. When I was talking about ProStyle and energy efficiency, I was speaking of the perception in today's world of thought ... not necessarily actuality ...
4. I'm not ready to put the nail in the coffin of ProStyle ... but I do believe that a better trained sales force would make it easier and more effective when a potential customer comes thru the door ...
Before the tax cut there was
Before the tax cut there was no deficit. After the tax cut there was a deficit. There may have been an attack, two wars and an economic meltdown since the tax cut, but the evidence is clear. The deficits started with the tax cut. The deficits started with the tax cut. The deficits started with the tax cut.
Do American's who will get the tax increase need the money? No. Would they spend the money to the betterment of the country? No. How do we know? We have 10 years of data.
No one, no matter where the money comes from, will make investments creating significant employment within the borders of the US, unless our standard of living drops, or tarrifs rise, or the rest of the world looks a whole lot worse.
Before the tax cut we were still in debt.
Deficts are caused by spending. Period. Until our government stops spending more than they bring in we will have deficits. Tax Revenues were about the same after the Bush Tax cuts as before and have been above their historical average for some time. Until our elected leaders stop spending like drunken sailors there will never be enough. Stop spending money. My money is better in my hands. Your money is better in your hands. I don't care what you do with it. It is better in your hands. You actually believe that sending your hard earned to the government to create generation after generation of people who can't take care of themselves is the for the betterment of our country? Who are you to judge what anyone does with their money? If I remember correctly, Clinton was as surprised as anyone that there was a surplus. But even then we were trillions in debt.
Deficits
You Said: "Tax Revenues were about the same after the Bush Tax cuts as before ...."
The Congressional Budget Office begs to differ. The revenue drop off was massive.
CBO Historic Revenue Report
You Said: "Deficits are caused by spending."
Sort of......but not entirely.
Actually deficits are the result of a simple equation, that starts something like this:
Revenues (taxes) - Expenses (spending) = X
If X is positive, you have a Surplus while if X is negative you have a Deficit.
Spending just can't be a deficit all by itself.
The rest of it.......
Whatever
SPENDING
As a percent of GDP it remained stable. At the end of the Bush 43 Era Individual Income Tax Revenue as a percent of GDP was 8.5%. At the end of the Carter Era, 8.7%. Reagan - 8%; Bush 41 - 7.6%. Clinton was 10.3%. Revenues did drop after the tax cut, but you must take into account the recession after September 11. Revenues dollars dropped 12%, but so did GDP. Spending increased more than 20%.
I don't claim to be a genius, but It seems to me the problem is on the spending side.
Deficits and War
Bob,
As you and AA debate taxes and the cause of deficits, you might take into consideration the cost of war. According to the Dept of Defense, the DOD's budget for 2009 was approximately $ 651 Billion. This represents (according to DOD) a 74% increase over spending in 2001.
Not included in this amount is the military spending outside of the DOD budget, which by some estimates kicks the total up to $ 850 Billion and possibly over one Trillion.
I support our troops and I support a strong national defense. But, as one politician put it, "we are borrowing money from the Chinese in order to send troops to Iraq to train policeman, while we are, at the same time, laying off policemen at home.
A deficit is the result of spending exceeding revenue. We spend more on defense than any nation on earth and as long as we do we will have to either reduce other spending, raise taxes or accept the inevitability of a federal deficit.
What to cut
From Obama's Debt commission. "At present federal revenue is fully consumed by three programs. Social Security, Madicare and Medicaid. The rest of the Federal Government is being financed by China" Consider these facts:
Obviously those older have had more time to accumulate wealth. Consider a 70 year old widow with $18,000 retirement income living in a home Worth $300,000 free &clear. She will probably be receiving property tax forgiveness, perscription drug subsidies and a host of others. She can expect to gain about $165,000 more in beneits than she paid in all types of taxes if she retired in 2005. Who really benefits here? Not the woman, but her heirs. We can start saving money by ending programs that subsidize those with high net worth that can easily be turned into cash. It makes no sense to use the tax system to force Americans with less wealth to subsidize those with more wealth.
Sounds like ...
... you're jealous, Mate !!! As Cohiba sez, that $$$ she's "got" ain't gonna last very long if she has a long term illness requiring constant care, or some other problem befalls her !!! Actually that $$$ is a pittance by some standards !!!
Amen Brother....
....Bermuda Bob. Some people just don't get it.
What to cut II
Mook,
Sure, let's make the old biddy sell her house to finance her doctors and prescriptions, she probably won't live that much longer anyway.
Better still, let's just get rid of all those old rich people over 65. Who cares if they worked for 40 years to earn that $ 18,000 retirement or to pay off that $ 300,000 house. Old people are obviously the problem with our economy. Gimmee a break !
We should cut Ponzi Schemes.
A person retireing in the early 2000's can expect to receive $165,000 more in benefits than they paid in all of their taxes. A man entering the workforce in 2000 can expect to pay $312,000 more in taxes than he will ever receive in benefits. You can not keep your wealth when you are dead. Why are those with less net worth subsidising those with more? If the heirs want the house than take care of your parents. This is a Ponzi scheme, and with any Ponzi scheme, those who get in early make out. The thing about Ponzi schemes, they always collapse.
Under No Circumstances ...
... should people have kids so they have someone to take care of them in their dotage ... That's selfish and immoral !!!
The selfless and moral answer
No, you take care of your parents because it is your responsibility. Your saying the selfless and moral route is to take the money from a group of people with much less or no net worth so that your family does not have to assume any responsibility. Why would you want them to raise a finger? They can save their energy and money to hire lawyers and fight over over your assets.
Easy, now ...
... you have, as our British brethren say, " ... the wrong end of the stick ..."
1. Where is it written that my children are responsible for me ??? Nowhere ... not in Judeo-Christian dogma, that's for sure !!! The marriage vows say that a man and a women leave their families and become one ... that does not mean until they are "recalled" to do for the parents what they should have done for themselves !!!
2. I say that if you paid into Social Security, then you have the right to the expectations which were made to you when you first started wondering what the hell that deduction was for ...
3. Now, if your remaining heirs (family) has anything to quibble about after you are dead, then you didn't do a very good job of making your wishes known ... and that's that !!!
I knew a chap who put in his will that if any of his kids even hired a lawyer to question any of the provisions of his Will, that his entire inheritance would go to a charity ... There was no in-fighting over his Will when he died and everyone is still talking to each other !!! Smart man, indeed !!!
Mookie, you sound like a spurned lover who got burned ... Why the angst ???
What benefits do we Cut?
Mook.Exactly what is it that you want to take away from the old guys in order to make it easier on you younger guys? Medicare? Social Security? Hey, why not throw in the VA benefits for Vets too? What have they done for you lately?
Cohiba
Flaw in your argument
Mookster,There is a basic flaw in your argumnent that many young people make when thinking about Social Security. You are looking at Social Secuity as an investment and think you are entitled to a return on that investment. You think you should get back at least as much as you put in.
Social Security is not an investment, it is a tax! Like any other tax, our contributions don't have our name on them and we are not entitled to a specific benefit from what we pay in. Some taxes pay for our national defense and some taxes pay for public education. This tax is paid by people who work to provide some level of support for people who don't. I pay taxes for public education, but my children and I have all finished school. These taxes go for the common good, which is how a caring soceity operates.
With regard t how much you should expect to benefit from your Social Security taxes, you can only hope the generation behind you cares more about their elders than you seem to feel.
Flaws in the system
Ok, since your dying to make this just about Social Security, let's look at the flaws in the system. You are correct, social security is a tax. Even though the government for years has tried to sell the "lock box" / personal account lie, SS is a tax. Any excess (up to this year) went right to the general fund with a bond in return. Those "capital assets" in return are basically the hope that the American Public will have enough income to tax in the future to cover expenses. Well, this will be the first year that payouts will be more than collections (on just SS, as we have run deficits for years). Thats bad. As we continue to be a nation that transfers our wealth from the younger generations to older generations (SS is only one of many programs that do) our younger generations face a fairly bleak future. Dramatically increased taxes to pay for todays benefits. Benefits that will not be around for them. They can't be. We can not continue to pay for SS, Medicare, Medicaid, Prescription Drugs in their current form. Meanwhile, todays seniors will not even entertain the idea of reform. So you tell me, who is selfish here?
Bending Gravity
You know, there is more than a grain of truth to what Mookie said. There is quite a bit of political power held by the oldish. Their needs are focused, they vote, and they have the money to bend political gravity. I think the problems you list here and many of the complaints listed by Bob, are driven by a political process corrupted by money. Not the unusual corruption of graft, which at least can be policed, but of the normal selling of political souls required to get elected, and stay elected.
I have a belief that representative government could actually work. Representatives could actually make the decisions and compromises required so the system doesn't grind to a complete halt. But, I don't think our form of representative government has any chance of working.
These guys are puppets to so many special interests, and the least of these interests are actually the people they claim to represent. Can these guys adjust Social Security, or force a negotiated prices with the drug companies, or shut down a weapons system, or stop subsidizing some wealthy sugar farmer? Not much of a chance of that.
So because no one can afford to make politically difficult votes, we end up with programs which may have needed only a little bit of political maintainence getting further and further out of balance with the problems they were meant to solve.
You Make Such Seriously ...
... sound sense, my friend !!! Unless and until, WE, as a nation demand the type of accountability from our elected officials, we deserve, we will be mired in the malaise of self indulgence we will never be rid of ...
We DESPERATELY NEED elected officials that actually represent OUR expressed interests ... people truly dedicated to serving their constituents, who will never bow to the entreatments of lobbyists and/or special interests ...
I have often called for "Issue and Referendum" ... This is what I envision ... not the entrapments which some have rightfully called encumbrances, but a true "Vox Publica" ...
Do not feed the Lobbyists
Bob said: "................who will never bow to the entreatments of lobbyists and/or special interests ... "
Now see, you went a bit too far there with that last comment.
Lobbyists are bloody important, and are specifically protected in the 1st Amendment to the US Constitution (....and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.). Lobbyists are protected in the Constitution, and appliance salesmen are not.
Lobbyists inform representatives of the effects of existing or proposed regulations on a particular "special interest", and your representative is lucky to have them. Really. Effective government is not possible without them. Got to keep them.
No, you keep the lobbyists, but you need to find a way to eliminate their ability to hand out cash or golf trips to Scotland, or new Viking Ranges, or Bathroom remodels, or Botox treatments, or back stage passes to the Jonas Brothers, or 52" LED LCD Samsung HD 3D TV's, or the Ted Williams rookie card to congress. Yup, that's just the kind of stuff that can make a Congressmen change his or her vote. Change his or her vote in opposition to his her better judgement.
I mean really. Just imagine all the things any one of you might be willing to do (standing up with your pants on) for any one of the above party favors. See what I mean?
I Totally Agree ...
... with you !!! So how quickly can you put those changes into effect ???
The problem you'll run into is that you're asking the Rooster to make changes in his habits when he's presented with a whole Hen House of ready and willing "participants" !!!
Not that he was a Lobbyist, but just look @ how Dennis Kosloski was able to skirt income taxes before he got crazy nuts greedy ... If a "civilian" can do that, imagine just how easy it is for and "insider" ... one look @ what's NOT happening in the Charlie Rangel case speaks volumes !!!
Excellent Cohiba
I like your response. I don't have the time to review and discuss as much this week. I have issues in three plants over two different states, sorry. But you represent all that I believe on this one. I hope you enjoy kicking back. This week I wish I was seven years older.
Clear Judgement and ...
... and an even better explanation, Cohiba !!!
I say that as someone who has railed against paying school taxes of 60% to 70% of our property taxes seemingly forever ...
Your comments succinctly illustrate the reason why we need to be electing RESPONSIBLE people to positions which make these decisions, and why some of those lifetime politicians need to be deposed so they can go and get a real job !!!
Why the youth are screwed
I am not saying that anyone should not get out of SS what they put in. What I am saying is that the retiree today will get far more out of the system today (medicare, SS, Medicaid, Perscription Drug program, local property tax forgiveness etc.) than they ever put into the system. Workers entering the work force today (if they can find a job, as we have 50% + youth unemployment) don't have a prayer of coming close. They will pay far more that they ever receive. And on top of it all, they will be the ones who get stuck putting things back together again after we go bankrupt. THEY do not have a prayer because the greatest generation begat the most selfish generation.
Keep Feeding
I'm not saying abolish these programs, but here is a good place to start. Do we continue to subsidize those who have enough wealth accumulated who can easily take care of themselves? Do we continue to disregard the welfare of future generations? Our deficits demand corrective action. How can anyone who will draw out every penny of taxes that they have paid in benefits within a couple years not be seen as living at the expense of others. Let me guess which age group you fall closer to? It takes a special type of callousness to diregard the welfare of future generations so that you can continue feed at the trough. But what the hell, both todays politicians and seniors will be dead by the time the crap really hits the fan.....
Social Security etc
I can't tell from your information here but you are looking at $$ when you should be comparing buying power, which takes into account inflation. Since the money passes from your check immediately to a retiree, this money is not invested. The only issue is buying power.
A worker exchanges buying power now, in the way of social security taxes, to receive buying power later, in the way of social security payments.
There have been discussions about "means testing" payments, but that would turn social security from a universal right to a inverse status symbol. Usually discussions of SS corrections discuss later retirement, or higher rates, or lower payouts. But this could have the negative result of delaying retirements and gumming up the employment of younger replacements. Still worth a try.
Your request that the kids pay the health costs of the elderly is rather tribal, creating a bizarre incentive for huge families.....which perversely will increase public education costs that Bob just complained about. Public education is one of America's greatest contributions to civilization. Bob suggests we chuck that over the side. Health care technology, and the resulting longevity is one of America's greatest contributions to humanity. Does Mookie suggest that life and health only be enjoyed by those with means, or did I misunderstand?
Yes, all these things, health care, social security, education, taxes, tarriffs, military, corporate welfare and supports, overseas entanglements, need to be considered in reaching a balanced budget. Changes more painful than anyone is willing to consider are required to reach balance. I am not convinced that the paths you are both recommending will result in anything approaching a balanced budget.
STOP SPENDING
Everybody recognizes there is a problem but no one wants to be part of the solution. I hear "keep your damn hands off my social security" on one side and "give me free medical care" on the other. Everybody buying time hoping someone fixes the problem but does not take their slice of their pie. Ride it out and stick future generations with the bill. I feel an obligation to pay taxes to our great country (almost 50% do not pay federal income tax) and have no problem doing so, But before they take more from me is it not reasonable to ask for some type of plan? Our deficit has increased at an alarming rate. We have now spent more on the Stimulus than the Iraq war. What do we have for it? There is no end in sight. Before they take more money, show me how your going to cut expenditures. Then, if you need to, raise my taxes. STOP SPENDING FIRST.
Defense vs De Fence !!!
Instead of discussing the wisdom of Iraq and/or even the volunteer military, there might be some, like myself, who think that the cost of enforcing "de fence" against illegal immigration, or a way of allowing "guest workers" would be even better $$$ spent !!!
Compromises will always need to be made, but starting with a budget balanced against that which is brought in is not the worst place to start ... at least it might make me feel better about being taxed as unfairly and exorbitantly as I contend we are !!!
Taxes
Higher taxes today will require a massive infusion of a stimulus in the near future. Keep the tax cuts in place but make business invest that money at home.We are learning that government control cannot instill a good economy by itself.
Excellent Example of ...
... the stupidity that government is the answer !!! Essentially the "plan" would continue to be to raise taxes, which need to be offset by an additional infusion of stimulus, which, by the way, is paid for by taxes !!!
How about we don't spend more than we take in ??? How about we cut spending and balance the budget ??? Big government is never the answer ... it is the problem ... when people stop thinking that politicians have all the answers, we will all be better off !!!
I have no quibble ...
... with your contention about the Deficit, but I do about the impact of the de facto Tax Increase ... each and every financial report to address the investments of small business in the economy cite overwhelmingly that they are not making those investments because they expect their bottom line to be adversely altered by the action Obama decides upon ... remember, your definition and his of who/what the higher incomes are differs significantly !!!
As you know, I believe we pay way too much in income taxes presently, and would prefer a consumption type of tax by comparison ... consider this:
1. We require people on pensions to pay income tax, especially those on disability pensions !!! Isn't that immoral ???
2. Our tax system has long discouraged savings because savings, like inheritances (no matter how large), are taxed !!!
3. We pay sales tax on after-income-tax purchases ... that's double taxation ... A consumption tax would allow you to pay taxes only when you spent your earnings, which, you have no choice but to do ...
4. A Tariff on incoming products would be something akin to Double Jeopardy ... we're already sending our jobs overseas (a topic we've addressed before) and then tax the overseas producer, who, in turn raised their prices, because just like here, no manufacturer does not pass on business taxes !!!
5. We all think that we pay an inordinate amount of property taxes, and why is that ??? Simply put, because of education ... somewhere in the area of 60%-70% of your property tax dollar goes to education !!! I don't know about you, but I think that if you have kids, it's your responsibility to educate them along with feed, clothe, and house them !!! I have not had kids in the school system for close to 20 years ... Why am I paying for someone else's kids ???
You cannot alter the standard-of-living of the upper income levels without penalizing the lower income levels ... Flat taxing EVERYONE means that EVERYONE forces all forms of government to live within the confines of a budget just like all our families have to !!! It would force the end of Deficit Spending and return us to the Representative Republic we were organized as ... representative of the way we all ought to live !!!
Crowded at the Top
AA ... At one time the "high-end" was populated by a very few innovative brands and consumers that wanted an oven with something more sophisticated than an off-the-shelf Robert Shaw control had fewer choices. The market really wasn't that big then (by industry standards) but we didn't need it to be. We weren't dependent upon volume production runs (100 ovens/day was a big deal). And, we didn't need critical mass to manage direct markets in the boondocks, because we had distributors that took our products to market.
But all the manufacturers wanted a piece of the lucrative high-end consumer and it got too crowded at the top. GE & Whirlpool/KitchenAid followed the two-tier strategy that you mentioned and before long, Thermador, Dacor and DCS found themselves competing with lower cost suppliers for floor space.
The high-end market didn't die. It just expanded. High-end products used to be the "tip of the iceberg" and then the iceberg tipped over.